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Hi all,

I'm a graduate graphic designer who really wants a proper education in typography! I've been signing up to dozens of typography foundries and browsing forums to try and understand the complex world of type. This forum has been extremely helpful.

I'm starting a project for a new small company in the medical field. It's a medication review which offers a more holistic's hard to explain! They need a logo, brochure, letterhead, report, website etc.

The font has to be professional, simple, and maybe with a slightly 'caring' feel to it. It's aimed at medical professionals, hospitals etc. Doctors get heaps of promotional material so I think that using a quality font or complete font package, along with good graphic design, could help catch their eye.

What would be a professional-yet-modern-yet-caring typeface? I'm open to using a combination of typefaces or a type family to create this brand.

Thanks for your time.

Double post

Hello first topic here,

I'm looking for a serif or sansserif font for a English/Russian book, I'm going to design. Any ideas of high quality independant foundries providing these.
I thought about the Fedra Pro from Peter Biľak of the Fedra Serif A?
Any other ideas?

Many thanks for your help,


Hi Everyone -
i am new to typophile and i hope you can give me some suggestions.
I am searching for some Sans Serif Families which can be an Alternate to Helvetica.
They should have a thin or ultra/extralight/light version too.
Teh typeface should not look very humanistic - instead more straight! I already consider for example Akkurat/FF Din as Alternates, but i am not very satisfied.

Would be thankful for every suggestion!
Best, Adam

i am working on a logo for a company which will distribute and sell the carhartt clothes (both work and street) via online shop in slovakia.
i made this bunch of logotypes and now i can't decide which one fits best for this kind of company.
i drew all the letters myself except of the version L - that is avenir.

which one would you choose?

thank you.

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I was looking at both, they both seem pretty much the same design-wise (note that I haven't verified closely). I was wondering if any of you knew which one was best (not only design wise)? I'm not sure but it seems Bitstream's is a TTF in a OTF, whereas ITC's is a PS in OTF.

Also I was wondering what sans-serif you'd use with it, I was thinking maybe FF Scala Sans Pro since it has support for many languages, and a good range of features like Charter, and a design that would fit well I think. Only problem is that I cannot try it for real because the only font I have from both is Charis SIL (Charter clone) that lacks many of the features I want, but I thought some of you would know.



I'm currently working up a nameplate for a student magazine. The magazine features mostly news features and opinion and will be published four times in the academic year. The magazine is reasonably high-brow and serious, but with a student focus. Anyway, for the nameplate/flag/logo/wordmark, I drew on inspiration from the New York Magazine's nameplate.

With some help from the Type ID board here, I settled on Bellevue. There are some really beautiful swashes in Bellevue, but unfortunately the M doesn't have any. So I'd like to butcher some of the swashes from other characters and Frankenstein them onto the M.

In the attached image, from top to bottom: Unaltered, first version, second version. I like that there's more to the second version, but with scaling the swashes up and down I feel the scale and weight of the strokes have suffered. Any help appreciated!

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Are there any guidelines about designing punctuation? Especially their size.

It seems clear that it needs to be (relatively) bigger in text than display, but by how much? Or is there no way besides experiment?

I need something like a circuite board illustration. Like the circuit paths on the board? For use in a tech type illustration?

Vectors? Anyone? :-)


Hello everyone. I am designing a high school newspaper for my campus, called "The Pioneer". What it pioneered, I do not know.

Here it is:

Some info: the campus publication industry in the Philippines is hyper-competitive -- annual press contests influence school press offices to twerk their writing bugs. And being stuck with Arial and Times New Roman means total loss in this arena (because duh).

Last year, they used system Franklin Gothic and Proforma. Here, it's Flama and Farnham. Thoughts?

I need to select fonts to give a new business (mine - and I'm not a graphic artist) a specific vintage look and feel. Of course, I hope to create - as much as possible - a unified presentation for a variety of venues including letterhead, e-mail, e-commerce website (viewable on desktop, tablet and smartphone), print catalog, and collateral materials.

In addition to a unified look, the other interest was in selecting fonts to create a memorable impression for the business. I'd like the lettering to stand out enough that people might notice it is something a little different –and yet be able to read it with ease.

The present product logo uses Benguiat which, while a “young” font, was used to convey a product with qualities circa 1900 –a little art nouveau and a little arts & crafts. A company logo is still to be designed, but the present thinking was to use Benguiat again to convey the relationship between product brand and maker. The website design target is essentially vintage modern –basically how a turn of the century business might have designed a website (had the internet existed at the time).

Now to my core question: My understanding had been that “serif is for print and sans serif is for electronic media.” If so, having a single vintage serif font for text use in print and electronic media would not work. Please let me know if the use of serif fonts is still viewed as restricted to print (especially now that people are moving to ever smaller screens on smart phones).

If not, then are there particular serif fonts suitable to use “everywhere.” If a separate sans serif font is needed for electronic media, are there those best to use for that media which would also work well with a “serif partner” for print. (BTW - Obviously, I do not think a single sans serif will work aesthetically for both print and web...but that does not mean I am right.)

Thank you for your input! (And sorry for the length of this, but it seemed best to provide the particulars.)

i am doing a corporate design with "RGB Colors".
For print purposes i am using the Pantone neon colors (801-812).
But i am missing a real RGB "cyan" like RGB:00ffff.

does anyone know a special color, which could fit for this?
i didn't find it in Pantone, HKS, nor in RAL.
(everything i found, was more light blue or mint green.)

My wife Caroline, a textile designer (wovens, mostly upholstery), wants a sans for use herself in correspondence, invoices and so on, and that she can use for printed material. It needs therefore to work on ordinary laser-printed output, as well as properly set and printed. She is insistent it be sans. She is quite interested in the idea of having one face for headings, titles etc, and another for the text ... in which case I suspect we'd go for a geometric/distinctive titling face and a more humanist and blander text face.

I find the choice bewildering. Of the fonts you see around a lot she likes both Gill and Futura, but she sensibly wants something different. She likes OS figures. She likes Futura for its Bauhaus connections (a lot of her textile work is Bauhaus inspired) more than for what it looks like, I think. She tends to shrink away from anything quirky -- she reckons, probably rightly, that she needs something pretty plain. (She finds Lux and Giacomo, for instance, which I like a lot, too odd in parts.)

The current menu is: FF Kievit, TheSans, Syntax, Bliss, Parisine. I feel like a kid in a candy store, and simply cannot commit: but I can't afford to buy them all to try them out.

Any views, on these or others? We'd need only two weights, I think.

PS: from a personal point of view, since she is an American living in London, anything American (a fortiori anything RISD) would give her secret pleasure. But that's really a side issue: what she really wants is the best type for the job.

Make your comments on the type Serial Killer


Marcio Hirosse


I'm slightly confused on how to apply leading. It seems to me that there are two basic approaches. Unfortunatly, they don't seem to be compatible:

Approach 1
Readability is everything. A good starting point is 120% of the type size, which should be increased or decreased according to line length, and type characteristics such as descenders/ascenders.

Approach 2:
Leading is inherent to the manner in which a reader interprets the content. A fast paced novel should have tight leading, speeding the rythym of content. A book of poetry should have generous leading, slowing the rythym and enabling contemplation of individual lines.

So here's my questions:

1) I know there's not always a right approach, but is there one that's wrong more often than not?

2) Any other approaches?



I just discovered this site, and have been reading all the postings. I realize that this is an ancient, dead message thread, but I felt moved to respond.

I would absolutely prefer 'micro-(newline)electronics'; I find 'microelec-(newline)tronics' awkward. Just as you'd break a word between syllables, not arbitrariy, I'd prefer to break any kind of compound word between parts, in the most comprehensible place possible. A second point is that I'd also prefer to have the whole word 'electronics' instead of just 'tronics' widowed on the new line.

Ignoring the line break, this is how you'd read it - which is more natural and comprehensible?


Hrant, based on your comments, you might enjoy Francis Crick's book THE ASTONISHING HYPOTHESIS. Crick is one of the co-discoverers of the structure of DNA. The 'astonishing hypothesis' is that the mind is a manifestation of the physical brain. Crick specifically uses visual perception to illustrate this; it's a subject that fascinates me, as I'm sure it does many people here.

The signals from the retinas are sent directly to thousands of specialized visual-processing areas. Each processor looks for one very specific thing - a certain kind of horizontal line, a vertical line, diagonals at certain angles, certain colors. If a processor gets a match for what it 'looks' for, it sends a signal to the next level of processors. Eventually, a three-D model is constructed. You can look at an object on a tabletop, close your eyes and still reach over and pick the object up, because you have an accurate mental model of where that object is in space.

We're extremely good at spotting patterns - when we look at a dashed line, we see it as a line, not just a bunch of individual dashes. We instantly see an implied shape just by seeing parts of it. We're not confused when shapes are broken up - we can look through a multi-paned window, and we're not confused that our view is chopped into small rectangles. We can easily distinguish between individual objects even in a very cluttered scene - these things are all amazing. Most of the work of figuring these things out is done by these dedicated processors, working at a very low level.

There also seem to be processors that respond to anything remotely resembling a face - that's why something as abstract as :) is seen as a face; even the grill and headlights of a car can easily be seen as a face.

The way that these processors work also explains why we are easily fooled by certain kinds of optical illusions.

My favorite illustration in the book shows two clusters of outline circles like perfectly round 'O's. In the first group, all are complete except for one broken circle, which has a 'C' shape. The broken one instantly jumps out of the group in the first glance - you couldn't possibly miss it.

The second group is just the opposite: all circles are broken except for one. The one complete circle does not stand out at all - you need to hunt for it. The brain has high-speed, automatic tools for spotting broken geometric shapes, but not to automatically spot a complete shape among broken ones - you've got to work at that by brute force, examining each circle.

Which, coming around to a typographic topic again, suggests that some letter shapes work because they take advantage of the brain's built-in ability to automatically spot broken shapes - we're hard-wired to recognize the apertures in a letterform.

Thanks to another thread in this site, I now know how to say 'Tschichold' correctly - I've been asking people this for a long time. My guess would have been something close to 'shick-old,' so I've saved myself some future embarrasment.

Take care,

  • Paul

The Look of Sound: Marketing, products and technology in the American record industry, 1888-1967
By Nick Shinn

TYPO San Francisco 2013, April 11

An investigation into how new media creates voids that take shape as they suck up content, and how—against the grain of technological determinism—marketing and design influence the cultural formats that emerge. Three innovations are examined: the 78 rpm disc in 1898, the LP in 1948, and stereo in 1958.

This talk will be accompanied by illustrations of records and record players, branding, advertising, collateral and packaging (album covers), with contemporary sound clips.

A couple of “slides” to whet your appetite:

As you may have noticed from the critique section, we are digitizing Alf Becker's 268th demonstration lettering Modern Spencerian Script, from Signs of the Times magazine from May of 1954.

Alf Becker's lower case

As a demonstration of the script for artists, it was great. For digitizing, it has been - difficult. The lower case f is a prime example. The forward down stroke is almost completely inconsistent with the rest of the lettering. This was okay for brush work because everything was adjusted on the fly by the artist. But, for creating a consistantly usable letter it is difficult...

This is what we came up with as our baseline f and fits all characters, esp bhijklt.

This one is an alternate for acdegmnopqrsuvwxyz has a shorten crossbar.

Another alternate overlapping ligatures of bhijk

Finally, actual ligatures...

We are also considering another, scripty lower case for purists. I think that might cover all of the bases. Did I miss anything? This is just for the lower case f. How many ligatures are normal, or rational, for a script.


...from the Fontry

I need to add a single cyrillic word into a manuscript I'm working on, but alas, the typeface I'm using (ITC Quay Sans Book) has no cyrillic version. So, I'm forced to cludge. Can someone looks this over and let me know if I've bolloxed it up?


Hello, I'm typesetting a book and after proof-reading it I found quite a few repeated words beginning or ending consecutive lines. My question is: how would you solve this? What are my options? Adding line breaks? Hyphenating words? Adjusting the space between words? Which of these options is the best? You can see an example below. Thanks. :)

pro-bono i completed last week.

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hey dudes, i'm designing a piece that i want to give a classy, 60s sort-of vibe (think capote, black-and-white ball, etc).

i'm just not sure where to go with the type treatment at this point. i was thinking maybe an ultra condensed sans-serif like univers??

any other suggestions? i'm kinda stuck

Any suggestions of type that would pair well with Bree?

The typeface from type-together.

Hello, Hello!
I need to know where I can find the "ITC Avant Garde" the ALTERNATES version. If anyone got it or k now where to fin it please let me know! Thanks! /Jake